Forgotten Warbirds

  • You remember wrong.


    The FTI report is a brief summary of the circumstances and factual information known at this time. It does not provide full details surrounding the accident, which is still under investigation.

    At this point, the investigation has determined the aircraft was returning from a routine surface reconnaissance mission followed by additional training (flight deck evolutions) for aircrew proficiency prior to landing on HMCS Fredericton. The helicopter had flown by the port side of the ship, from stern to bow, before making a left hand turn to establish a downwind leg in preparation for approach to the ship. The aircraft then commenced a final left turn to set-up for the approach. During this final complex manoeuvring turn to close with the ship, the aircraft did not respond as the crew would have anticipated. This event occurred at a low altitude, was unrecoverable, and the aircraft entered a high energy descent and impacted the water astern the ship.

    Directorate of Flight Safety releases initial report on CH-148 Cyclone accident - Canada.ca

    Mechanical failure was ruled out though, wasn't it? That was my point, I couldn't remember what exactly happened regarding it being pilot error, weather related, etc, but I did say that " nothing on the bird failed", as I remember having read that in several places/times, and that is correct, now that I've gone and read your link, and looked up ones I read last year, and others more recent. Both Janes and FlightGlobal said that the fleet was cleared due to the crash not being a mechanical failure, after the link you provided. There are a couple other articles that link previous software issues from 2017 to the crash, but they are hypothetical.


    https://www.flightglobal.com/h…-grounding/138887.article

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    Quote

    Mechanical failure ruled out of fatal CH-148 crash as RCAF lifts fleet grounding


    https://www.janes.com/defence-…e-in-ch-148-cyclone-crash


    Quote


    Canada rules out mechanical failure in CH-148 Cyclone crash

  • Fair enough, but the LCS with no stores/ammo on board would never take the pounding Thach did. Probably not 2 of any of those hits.


    That goes without saying—size matters. However, I question the value of knowing that one hulk can take more damage than the other hulk. Warships are floating pipe bombs.

    There is no difference between communism and socialism, except in the means of achieving the same ultimate end: communism proposes to enslave men by force, socialism—by vote. It is merely the difference between murder and suicide. —Ayn Rand

  • That goes without saying—size matters. However, I question the value of knowing that one hulk can take more damage than the other hulk. Warships are floating pipe bombs.

    There isn't any technical value, other than conversationally pointing out that a much older Frigate is demonstrably tougher than the wizzbang new one(s), and yes I realize they are much different in terms of design and materials, but there is only about 500t difference in displacement (I think). There are no other metrics really, it's not like they are going to load up SINKEX targets with stores, and the few ships since the cold war that have been hit with exploding bombs/missiles (Falklands in particular re the unexploding hits) have had just as much a random result in terms of damage as the human body has with gunshot wounds. SINKEX certainly isn't scientific in terms of damage modelling (they are obviously weapons/systems/etc tests), or a valid test of what ship types are more vulnerable than others, but it's really all there is in terms of live weapons vs modern ship hulls effects other than the very few ships hit.


    But you're right, warships are floating bombs, and should anything get through the defenses these days, no matter what kind of ship, short of the retired BBs, it's likely to have a pretty bad day. Damage control ability was one thing about the LCS too - few hands make harder work when it comes to damage control.

  • What I should have said is that they tried to sell a large corvette as a small frigate.


    LCS has great potential as a force multiplier, by that I mean tin cans can dedicate themselves to their jobs while LCS is handling the arduous duty of shelling shore batts with sniper like precision... all while maneuvering at high speed in shallow draught.

  • If all you guys just wanted a stealthy gun/missile corvette for littoral work, I'm sure we could have made some more Skjold-class boats. Just saying... Cruising at 47 knots, and 60+ at flank, there's not really anything that can touch it that's not flying. Certainly no terrorist gunboat/suicide bomb.


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    There is no difference between communism and socialism, except in the means of achieving the same ultimate end: communism proposes to enslave men by force, socialism—by vote. It is merely the difference between murder and suicide. —Ayn Rand

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