1911 in .45 or 9mm

  • What does that even mean? I mean... I know wrag gets it but now you are acting like you somehow get it... whatever 'it' is.


    lazs

    "Don't let it end like this. Tell them I said something."



    Pancho Villa, last words (1877 - 1923)

  • Wrag gets it.


    Now if only others would.




    Dietrich Bonhoeffer: “Silence in the face of evil is itself evil. God will not hold us guiltless. Not to speak is to speak. Not to act is to act.”


    Presbyterian Rev. Gilbert Tennant:

    “He that suffers his life to be taken from him by one who has no authority for that purpose, when he might preserve it by defense, incurs the Guilt of self murder since God has enjoined him to seek the continuance of his life, and Nature itself teaches every creature to defend itself.”

  • I really don't get any of this bullshit... This thread is about what caliber you'd want a 1911 in. I'd want one in .45 or 10 mm. What this thread has degenerated into is as stupid as every ricer vs. bimmer thread on every ricer or bimmer forum.

    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

  • I really don't get any of this bullshit... This thread is about what caliber you'd want a 1911 in. I'd want one in .45 or 10 mm. What this thread has degenerated into is as stupid as every ricer vs. bimmer thread on every ricer or bimmer forum.

    Welcome to the last 10 years of FW.

  • I'm not getting your point GS

    That's because you only drive American and have never been anywhere near a ricer or bimmer forum. Which might be a good thing I freely admit...

    "With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

  • :biglaugh


    now we get into cars... ?

    Dietrich Bonhoeffer: “Silence in the face of evil is itself evil. God will not hold us guiltless. Not to speak is to speak. Not to act is to act.”


    Presbyterian Rev. Gilbert Tennant:

    “He that suffers his life to be taken from him by one who has no authority for that purpose, when he might preserve it by defense, incurs the Guilt of self murder since God has enjoined him to seek the continuance of his life, and Nature itself teaches every creature to defend itself.”

  • jap bikes suck...they're perfectly adequate for housing a 9mm pistol

    A narrative doesn’t require truth to remain viable, it requires the capacity to punish.

    “Diversity is our Strength” is made ludicrous by the entirety of human experience and conflict.

    But since you can be fired for denying it, there it sits like a turd on a silver tray.


  • Life is too short to ride a jap bike or drive a jap car.


    How did we get here? you could ask that about any FW thread but really... razer started the thread I believe.. so it is pretty much his.


    He asked the question... then when he got the answers he suddenly changed it to "fuck it... 1911's are too expensive and don't hold enough ammo anyway"


    No way any razer thread on 1911's is gonna end well or stay on track. Best you can hope for is some home shopping network thing for guns.


    lazs

    "Don't let it end like this. Tell them I said something."



    Pancho Villa, last words (1877 - 1923)

  • You think caliber debates are bad now, wait until the US Army's new LMG (articles all over defense sites this week, Fox News too about it) gets selected, as it'll be likely a telescoping round (posted tons about this subject here and the old site), and probably in the 6 mil range in between 556 and 762, yet far more capable then both. Telescoping ammo will come to handguns as well, and will ignite and expand all internet wars over calibers.


    I was going to mention something before about 9mm penetration (over penetration of the 115 NATO round). Our company had a bunch of older Canadian Army Sterling SMGs that were factory suppressed (they were JTFs before being retired), and we did a bunch of shooting with them. They had a similar system to the MP5SD where the integral can would trap gas even from supersonic NATO 9mm rounds, and render them just slightly subsonic. There was one non suppressed Sterling in that batch, and it would push 115 9mm out to the mid 1400 to 1500 fps range or faster due to the barrel length. Shooting trees out around the range, it would blow through many where 556 55gr ammo would not from 14.5 M4gery length rifles. Seemed very unintuitive, having a 556 round not going through barriers but 9mm would, but we tried it over and over with the same result. Likely the 556 rounds were fragmenting in the soft wood trees, but those 9mm rounds would stay together and obviously blow through.

  • Gman... I believe that tech will continue to drive military and defense bullet design and .. the case for that matter. In the military thing... ball ammo. not sure if that will always be a thing. but the 5.56 pretty much stretches the original intent of ball by fracturing at the canelure Bullets that shatter.. etc. So long as ball is the thing then caliber will make a difference. Velocity is still too low for handgun ammo to penetrate and expand etc reliably so caliber makes a difference.


    Hunters know this. Hunters like self defense and police can use any type of bullet they want pretty much. At this point some handgun rounds that were neglected or almost obsolete are gaining popularity and in the specialty or custom ammo versions at least are using very high tech expanding bullets... even the lowly 32 auto and 25 auto are getting woot zoot bullets. The 45 acp just refuses to die and for good reason. nowdays when a new bullet design comes out it almost always comes out in 45 acp and 9mm at the same time. They are generally really poor hunting choices tho.


    We are seeing 45's in 185 grain at almost 1200 fps.. this is as fast as a 9mm but much heavier and larger dia.


    For me... a very old cast bullet for the 45 acp is one I cast. It runs right at 200 grains cast and coated with HT or PC (both coatings getting more popular in factory ammo) I run it right around 1050 fps from my 1911's. It is a target bullet from the 40's or 50's meant to punch nice clean holes in paper. for scoring... it was generally pushed at moderate speeds like 700 fps. Hunters found that it would punch a large caliber hole in game and drop em as well as a hot 44 spl.


    lazs

    "Don't let it end like this. Tell them I said something."



    Pancho Villa, last words (1877 - 1923)

  • One thing about this load... if you are a handloader this is a very inexpensive round to shoot. for me casting my own bullets it runs under $4 a box of 50... extremely accurate and fun to shoot... hitting a gallon jug of water you would think it was hit by a .357 mag. If you don't cast your own but still load... you can get the bullets in bulk of 1k or so for pretty cheap.. it is a very popular cast slug... this would make the ammo cost a few dollars more a box to say $6 a box of 50


    Now the advantage would seem to be... you are shooting the round you use to hunt/self defense. And..... you can shoot a lot of em for cheap.


    lazs

    "Don't let it end like this. Tell them I said something."



    Pancho Villa, last words (1877 - 1923)